Pony Venting Thread

@Latecomer

The blatant merch marketing forcing for the S2 finale definitely forced the writers to scramble, a trend that'd only get worse and I assume led to frustration when introduced, but I think after the episode aired a lot of that died down due to the surprise villain.

Early seasons best vs late seasons best is a big point of argument and has been for years. There's surely no objectively correct opinion. I'm in the latter camp but I don't think it's as big a deal as it's often made out to be. Just a matter of preference.

Top five favorite episodes for various reasons being Perfect Pear (s7) Crusaders of the Lost Mark (s5) Sounds of Silence (s8) Sleepless in Ponyville (s3) and probably Hurricane Fluttershy (s2)

@EquusStorm
The episode we got might have been better than the one we expected, but I still found it a noticeable step down from the previous two-parters.

I'm in the split camp — my favourite seasons are all over — but do think the show both grew and declined in various ways over time.

As for those… good but massively overrated, hate it but can't help but admit the excecution is good, decidedly meh, and like the last two a lot.

Nobody plays Ouija anymore, this show use to have a soul.

@Latecomer
If your entire sense of "what made Season 1 special" is based on memories from ten years ago, you should probably rectify that before you commit to defending it.

@DerpyFast

That's the issue with a lot of early-show defense I think. Fandom was excited, vibrant, and happy in 2011-2012 and that really bled over into perceptions of episodes. Removing the nostalgia goggles and our newfound excitement at the show and fandom back then takes a lot of the fondly remembered magic away; that was more associated with the fandom than the early show imo. It did with me at least; as early as 2013 rewatching S1 only made me sad since the exciting magic of the finding the show and fandom had long faded and all that was left is the first season of a show struggling to find its groove. And the burnout from watching it too much in 2011 still hasn't even started to fade lol

Then there's the issue of the few still here and there that still only defend S1-2 because they're obsessed with Faust for some reason and don't like anything she didn't directly have a hand in. Those I think can't be reasoned with.

@DerpyFast
Yeah, maybe. But it's hard to imagine it suddenly seeming weaker than most of the rest of the show.


@EquusStorm
Wasn't the fandom vibrant because the show was beloved and fresh?

@Latecomer

Again, S1 is better than many shows' entire run, but for me personally, it got so much better later that it makes the beginning pale in comparison. We had no way of knowing in 2011 that there would even be future seasons, much less their content.

Keep in mind that death threats were involved.

Death threats to the show staff became depressingly common at multiple times along the show's run. People take cartoon TV shows way too seriously.

@EquusStorm
Indeed. But I'm afraid that while both the duration of the show and the quality of some episodes has been pleasntly surprising, there's also been a great deal of disappointment. So I really can't say the later seasons as a whole are nescessaily better at all, let alone "much"… well, maybe 7.

@Latecomer

Much better being subjective; I'm sure there are a great number that would disagree with me that the later seasons are that much improved. But that's just my personal thoughts after weighing the entire show against itself. I'll take the later seasons and y'all free to have the earlier ones. I'd take the better half of say, S7 over the entirety of many of them.

@EquusStorm
Well, we can agree on the latter at least. It's not really about "later" and "earlier" as much for me — I have favourites on either side.

Another one of my friends ragequitted the show because of Celestia and Luna choosing to retire. His mindset was "No, no, no. You two are immortal goddesses and trying to dump that on mortal ponies who already have as much to do as both you do already is against your ethics." he then slams a "DON'T FORGET, YOU'RE HERE FOREVER" sign in their throne room "Have a good day!"

@Red-Supernova
Well, that aspect was handled pretty poorly — it's what made me reject Season 9 from my headcanon from the start. Although that reaction is also way over the top…

@Red-Supernova
The funny thing is it's never actually been said that they are immortal long living sure but not immortal

@Latecomer
Not surprised. A lot of people did. And my friend is no exception because he has been working on a fanfic series that has been in development hell for the majority of the show's run. The alicorn race was a big factor in his story and he had big plot points over the importance of Celestia and Luna. So seeing them just dump their jobs was against everything that he had planned for. Even though I believe that aspect was meant to be a tribute to Lauren Faust's old vision of Twilight becoming the new ruler.
Yeah, my friend had a more down to earth reaction but I made it over the top on purpose.

@northern haste
Yeah but we have so many bronies who are into a ton of fantasy games with gods and goddesses and a lot of them like to claim that Celestia and Luna have similar positions as them. That's one of the behaviors you'll get when a show gets an unexpected audience.

@Latecomer
I think it's handled well, but you have to really read between the lines.

The tl;dr of my interpretation is that Starswirl disappearing left Celestia in a state of arrested development. She never built a support network, and she never gained a sense of independence. This meant that all she could do was defer to others. There's a recurring theme of "sacrifice" with Celestia's character. That, combined with her lack of independence and support to fall back on, is why she couldn't save Luna. And she suffered for it.

So when Princess Celestia received that letter all the way back in Season One, she knew that all of her past demons were going to resurface, and that she needed to make sure her student had what she lacked. So Twilight was sent to Ponyville and the rest is history.

She was able to succeed where her old mentor had failed. After our dysfunctional princess had kept things together for 1,000 lonely, guilt-ridden years, she gets to leave the kingdom in more qualified hooves, retire, and just be with her sister.

@Red-Supernova
Well, to be honest that kind of fanfic is always risky… but I also understand the pain of contradiction. I tried to make my headcanons adaptable, but there was some point where the existence of new episodes began to feel like a threat. Perhaps that's why some people would rather not watch?


@DerpyFast
Well, maybe… but I think that's pretty much 80%+ fanon. And not everyone's going to derive that from what we see on the surface.

I tried writing a fanfic back around s2, but as it started being incompatible with the show a couple seasons later I just tossed it, 20k words and all. Decided I'd much rather follow the show than diverge from it for something that no longer agreed with it.

I can't be 100% sure but I think it was Faust's original idea for Twilight to replace Celestia so if that's true I don't see why there would be issue with it since that was probably in the works from the moment the show launched. I personally think it was well done but perhaps abrupt as there really wasn't a long term build-up to it or very many explicit hints that was going to happen.

@EquusStorm
There's concept and then there's excution — as well as the question of whether what was suitable for Season 2/3 Twilight still fits Season 8/9 Twilight.

And I'm usually happy to rework stuff to fit with the show if what the show brings to the table is of superior quality. Which makes the mostly declining quality of the show over time (IMO) a problem..

My main thing is that what I was writing centered around the tree-library and Twilight still being basically a student so after S4 I'd have to count off half the show to make it work lol

@EquusStorm
Yeah, or go AU.

@Latecomer

I did that once Twilight became a princess but after the end of S4 realized so much had changed from the world in the beginning of the five it'd be a hassle to try to keep just keeping the AU going with all that was changing. That and I realized my story had basically been done many times before and kinda cringe so giving up and laying in the dirt sounded pretty appealing

@EquusStorm
Ah well… at least you enjoyed whst the show brought to the rable instead?

I just increasingly detached my headcanon from the show, starting with a few bits and pieces in Season 4 and finally fully breaking with it for Season 9.

@Latecomer

I know people who decided to stop watching after like S3 because they liked the feeling of the world before the larger changes started altering the feel of it shortly thereafter and that's fair. I'm kinda like that with some shows and games so it's understandable. There's no reason to force oneself to keep pushing through entertainment media that is no longer enjoyable since enjoyment is its purpose.

In all honesty I still greatly prefer the tree-library and I think Twilight ascended WAY too early in the show (though her being a princess was a requirement for a ton of S4-9 plots so that would've potentially been a writing problem) and I certainly preferred having the more consistent writing staff of earlier seasons.

I think being a Starlight fan probably helped me get into the feel of later seasons, along with the CMC finally having something to do besides repeat the same "what will we do this week to get our marks" episodes lol. The smaller, cozier feel of the world in the first few seasons is very nostalgic and pleasant but there are lots of individual characters I like that didn't come into being until later so it's sometimes hard to go back to before they were introduced.