Unofficial BLM-related Policy Change Discussion Thread

@FrecklesFanatic  
I mean if you want to hit an artist that cares where they care.
 
I don’t know about the spam and trolls.

@Ninji  
I get what you mean, and I agree. Actuall on topic comments are really nice.  
People still usually dont comment much on stuff unless its controversial, or already on the 200+ side of faves.

@byte[]  

 
People from /mlp/ use this site too but don’t regularly check the forums, as this ruling concerns controversial images and /mlp/ is practically the posterchild for that, i dont know why you’re surprised that Anons are trying to keep up with the discussions here to see how it effects them.
 
 
@byte[]  
@Background Pony #8E9A  
My main concern is that this rule is attempting to fix a problem that only exists when your existing rules are not enforced.  
If people start shitstorms over a particular image, recommend the filter and blacklist and reprimand them if they continue.  
If people are uploading a particular image and improperly tagging in order to bypass the above, then remind them of the system and reprimand them if they continue.
 
Deleting the image certainly makes the job easier on the mods, but also goes against the stated purpose of being an archive site and opens the door wider for personal bias.  
It’s a private site and you can obviously host what you want when you want, but trying to hide “I dont like thing” removals under a pretence of “It’s against the rules” leaves a bad taste in peoples mouths, and in my opinion thats exactly the impression that this new policy gives, nor do i seem to be the only person who thinks that from reading what other people have said both for and against this.

@Background Pony #AC85  
We didn’t really add a new rule, so much as start enforcing rule #0 more strictly…

@FrecklesFanatic  

 
Downvotes are for when you dislike a picture. Filtering is for when you dislike a subject matter.

@byte[]  
That’s kind of my problem with vague rules in general; they can always be amped up or throttled back and still be the “same” rule.
 
I understand they’re necessary, but it’s like they say; “The person you least want making the decisions on what is and isn’t acceptable, is always the person that ends up making those decisions.”

@The Walhi Llama  
You say that, but I could be several certain not-to-be-named fandom members and instantly shut down all criticism of the site for the sake of it being criticism of the site. We know and expect that not everyone is going to be happy with our policy decisions.
 
It’s up to you as to whether you trust us to enforce our rules in a way you think is appropriate.

I’m genuinely baffled that making a choice not to host bigoted content is even controversial. What does anyone have to gain from allowing bigoted ideas to be expressed, besides getting people angry and allowing those ideas to spread?
 
I don’t see the value in tolerating intolerance.

Hey, so long as you don’t start deleting the funny Nazi/communist photos or the pony racism pics, I’m cool with it.

@SuperSupermario24  
Because what qualifies as “bigoted” is vague, and it could lead to side favoritism on a website that promotes itself as an archival one. But I’ve had this discussion too many times by now. I need to go to bed.

@SuperSupermario24  
Some of us find enjoyment in that kind of humor and half the dialogue it spawns when it’s allowed to spawn.
 
You don’t save any lives or change any opinions by burying it, certainly.
 
But, that’s the nicest version of my two cents.

@byte[]  
Rule #0 was already being used too strictly to delete any comments a moderator subjectively considers “offensive” even if it is humorous in nature, doesn’t contain any naughty words or simply responds to an individual’s point. It’s a rule designed for abuse.  
I find it ironic how the site administration picked a (imo unpopular even among a left-leaning userbase) side that “condemns police brutality,” while giving its legal enforcers more power over the userbase. I suspect quite a few people who realize this will take their art and discussion to /mlp/ or /mlpol/ where there is less, if any, arbitrary censorship.

@Background Pony #380B  
Your insight is correct; we’d much rather you discuss such topics there.

Does the same apply to future uploads of far leftist content?

@Bexar Bandito  
This is rich coming from a guy who whole-heartedly endorses authoritarian censorship of opinions/points of view that he doesn’t agree with, even when those opinions are not actually racist, fascist, or even troll posts.

@Kutkabo  
If the “far leftist content” you refer to is using racist caricatures and taking advantage of current events to attack and antagonize people, then yes, we will remove it.

@byte[]  
Good.
 
Well, not really, but at least it’s unbiased.

@byte[]  
Rule 0 concerns user to user interaction.  
This new policy is expanding that to real world events and groups, and in your own words in a time-limited, mod-discretion sense.  
The problem arises because rule 0 is supposed to be blanket.  
I cant call someone a racial slur.  
They cant call me a racial slur.  
Neither of us can just wait X amount of time before doing so.  
It doesnt matter which of us is more popular or which of us has the most public support, if that rule is broken then the person gets punished, how the mod feels about the people involved shouldnt enter the equation.  
This policy on the other hand puts that decision in the hands of mainstream opinion, but more importantly the individual mods feelings on the matter.  
If a mod feels an image is part of a shitstorm then it’s removed.  
If a mod feels an image is not part of a shitstorm then it is not removed.  
A shitstorm could be ten people going at it, it could be a real world event like the rioting, the problem is that it’s unquantifiable and entirely up to the mod discretion with no perceivable line or boundary for users to self-moderate themselves.
 
And ultimately, once again it’s solved by your existing rules and systems.  
Tagging and Blacklists.  
If the majority of the problem is in the comment sections, encourage the systems you have rather than taking a hammer to the content being posted.

@Background Pony #AC85  

(Since people like byte[] haven’t seen this, and the thread it’s posted on is locked from discussion, I’m just gonna post it again, and yes, I’m the OP of this post.)
 

 
 
There was an image uploaded tagged to the black lives matter tag that simply and reasonably questioned the latest image tagged under the aforementioned tag, before it got deleted due to “rule 3”.
 
While it was still up, I was going to post this comment, one that I will ALWAYS stand by, word for word, and following the image’s deletion, I could NOT think of a better place to post this comment, for all eyes to see.
 
Here it is:
 

 

 
>Inb4 this comment section gets locked down, too.
 
 
Also, how is it that George Floyd’s death and not that of Eric Garner (who suffered the same fate at the hands of a corrupt police force in Staten Island back in 2014), or even that of Michael Brown (which happened the SAME YEAR as Eric’s), is what’s compelling this site‘s admin and staff to not only take this stance, but to make such an unprecedented and, in many respects, unnecessary policy change?
 
Can we at least have some honest, one on one transparency from the mods, admins, devs, assistants, etc. from their and not just ours? Are we—along with the staff—no longer allowed to post dissenting opinions or images that don’t necessarily agree with this stance/point of view that are not actually—nor necessarily—racist or trolling, especially from countless people like myself who are neither racist nor trolls?
 
If the answer to my second question is no, and especially if the answer to my third question is yes, REGARDLESS if the answer to the second one is a yes or not , then all I really have to say to this is that this is a sad, poorly thought-out and hastily conceived excuse of a decision made by this site’s administration.
 

 
And no, I am not arguing in bad faith, nor am I trolling around, here. I am 100% genuine in every word in this comment that I have posted here.
 
And if you can’t see that, then that is on you, and you ALONE. NOT me.

Hey mods?  
I’m addressing all of you rather than a single one in particular because I hope all of you see this, and posting as anon because I know you guys can see it anyway. Some of the long-term mods and admins might even remember be, but anyway:
 
Thank you.
 
I joined this fandom almost ten years ago when I was sixteen, back in high school. When the Brony fandom first came around it felt like one of the, biggest, most far-reaching, inclusive, powerful and positive explosions of unified creativity the world had ever seen. In many ways, borders got knocked down, people connected with each other, even the millenia-old idea of what it means to be a man was challenged and examined. I can’t understate how much of a impact it had on culture, in the long run. For better and for worse.  
I made life-long friends here that I still talk to every day, nine years since we met, and I still cherish the memories from the early days.
 
Unfortunately, as the years have gone by, I’ve watched one thing after another drive people away, whether it was the whole Down-With-Molestia nonsense, the great migration from Ponibooru, Lauren Faust leaving the show, Twilicorn, C&D orders slapped on community projects by Hasbro, and backlash from the rest of the general public at large, among other things.
 
For a couple years now, it’s been the encroachment of the alt-right.
 
The trouble with the stance that “everyone is welcome” is that some people will take that good faith and abuse it. Bad actors are pretty damn good at that, I’ve found over the years.  
To use a metaphor: If you open a space welcome to both sheep and wolves, you will end up with only wolves.  
I’ve watched a community I held so close to my heart be invaded, colonized, and some would argue taken over by people who forgot their humanity, and it breaks my heart.
 
I still remember love and tolerance.  
And now I’m wise enough to know that we cannot tolerate intolerance.
 
Maybe this is a sign of things changing for the better. I want to believe it. It gives me hope.
 
Thank you for doing the right thing.  
Black Lives Matter.
 

 

@Background Pony #B4AF  
*their end

@byte[]  

 
 
So how is pictures like this still up ? https://derpibooru.org/images/2362292

@Background Pony #9B04  
How does that boot taste?