"artist:kurosawakuro" should imply "base used"

Tagging Discussion » "artist:kurosawakuro" should imply "base used" Search Posts
Ciaran
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Senior Moderator
友情は魔法だ
@Background Pony #E408
Base Used is really a DeviantArt term that we don’t support as such in our processes. For us, ‘Base Used’ is just DA slang for ‘Trace’, but the word we really use and depend on is ‘Edit’ (which indicates a derivative copyright) and the artist tag of the other copyright holder.
‘Base Used’ often obfuscates things more than it clarifies it, so personally I wouldn’t imply that tag ever for any purpose, and would instead imply ‘Edit’ and add to the description that the uploader should also tag the creator of the ‘Base’ that was traced or recolored.
In the example of , the traced ‘base’ is by the base maker ‘ElementBases’ - it looks like all their bases are from the TV show so the copyright ends there. That is, there’s no fan artist on the other side of that base who also needs to be credited because the work is derivative of their own work.
If the work is derivative of Hasbro’s art, then we usually don’t mention it. We just go back as far as we can see Fan Artists and when it hits something Hasbro branded we’re done.
But ElementBases does ask that anyone using their bases give them credit for the base, so the uploads here using bases by that artist should somehow credit the artist - either via a mention in the description (which is what they ask for) or by adding their tag to the image (which is what helps us with our processes).
I’ve added “Edit” and “Artist:ElementBases” to that image … that is actually preferable to just adding the “Base Used” tag since that isn’t actually functional within our practices.
So … I don’t think we should imply ‘Base Used’. Ever. But I think there are likely many images with this artist’s tag that do not reflect the true copyright path or crediting all the artists who should be credited.
Maybe a better solution is to add a description asking people to make sure they tag all the artists involved and also tag the image as an ‘Edit’ to mark it as a derivative copyright, and then work through all those images to make sure the appropriate ‘Base’ creator is credited as they would like to be, and to ensure there is no fan artist upstream of the ‘Base creator’ who also needs to be credited.
Mildgyth
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Senior Moderator
Humata, Hukhta, Hvarshta
Moreover, other argument against the implication is what if in the future the artist decides to start drawing without using bases?
Background Pony #E408
@Background Pony #E408
Base Used is really a DeviantArt term that we don’t support as such in our processes. For us, ‘Base Used’ is just DA slang for ‘Trace’, but the word we really use and depend on is ‘Edit’ (which indicates a derivative copyright) and the artist tag of the other copyright holder.
‘Base Used’ often obfuscates things more than it clarifies it, so personally I wouldn’t imply that tag ever for any purpose, and would instead imply ‘Edit’ and add to the description that the uploader should also tag the creator of the ‘Base’ that was traced or recolored.
While it’s true that it would be properly called an “edit”, there’s more nuance to it IMO - bases are intended to be edited. I wouldn’t call images using them a “trace” because usually the original lines are included intact, just recolored and with partial changes for detail and the addition of manes/accessories/etc. There is no overdrawing or recreation of the original, no “tracing” - the visible portions are verbatim.
I also think it’s valuable to tag, as the phenomenon (by whatever name) of using bases/dolls is widespread and well-known.
A mere “edit”+artist credit does not communicate either distinction. Those could be used in addition to another tag (ie. “base used”)
And, if I may say, they tend to be prolifically created and may have a repetitive style, which I could liken to a reason that, for example, “koikatsu” and “source filmmaker” are tagged but “photoshop” or “paint tool sai” aren’t.
But ElementBases does ask that anyone using their bases give them credit for the base, so the uploads here using bases by that artist should somehow credit the artist - either via a mention in the description (which is what they ask for) or by adding their tag to the image (which is what helps us with our processes).
Note, the original posts on deviantArt have the credit in their descriptions; it is the failure of whoever is reuploading those here to copy the descriptions over.
Moreover, other argument against the implication is what if in the future the artist decides to start drawing without using bases?
This is precisely why I mentioned that I’d normally call artist tag implications an overreach, but that account has not done so in the span of 3 years and over a thousand images.
Ciaran
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Crystal Roseluck - Had their OC in the 2023 Derpibooru Collab.
Flower Trio - Helped others get their OC into the 2023 Derpibooru Collab.
A Lovely Nightmare Night - Celebrated the 12th anniversary of MLP:FIM!
Princess of Love - Extra special version for those who participated in the Canterlot Wedding 10th anniversary event by contributing art.
Tree of Harmony - Drew someone's OC for the 2022 Community Collab
Elements of Harmony - Had an OC in the 2022 Community Collab

Senior Moderator
友情は魔法だ
@Background Pony #E408
Good points, but for us when keeping track of how images are created, and when dealing with traced images and copyright disputes the focus is on tracking the copyright, and ‘Base Used’ isn’t a term we use. So that tag, while it may be useful for searching, isn’t something that I think we’ve ever seen as being an official tag that we would want to bake into any of our processes or add as an implication to another tag.
The ‘Base Used’ tag certainly is used by a lot of people though to filter or search for images. But it isn’t a good fit for how we deal with traces, recolors, and derivative copyright. So if we were to imply some tag, I think it should be something that we actually use.
And, like I said, in the case of this specific artist, it might be better to make sure that the artists whose work was used is properly credited on those images, and to ask the uploaders of this artist to do a better job of making sure they copy the descriptions as a part of the upload and credit the bases who were used.
I will try to do some of this over the weekend. It might be something where a large set of these images can be handled in bulk, and if there’s fewer than a dozen uploaders then I could just send PMs to those people and maybe add something to the artist’s description, and watch for more images in the future.
It might not be that simple, but if it is, then problem solved ^_^
Background Pony #E408
@Background Pony #E408
Good points, but for us when keeping track of how images are created, and when dealing with traced images and copyright disputes the focus is on tracking the copyright, and ‘Base Used’ isn’t a term we use. So that tag, while it may be useful for searching, isn’t something that I think we’ve ever seen as being an official tag that we would want to bake into any of our processes or add as an implication to another tag.
Ah, I see, understood.
…and to ask the uploaders of this artist to do a better job of making sure they copy the descriptions as a part of the upload and credit the bases who were used. …. if there’s fewer than a dozen uploaders then I could just send PMs to those people and maybe add something to the artist’s description, and watch for more images in the future.
You’ll have to flex your moderator power, because 90% of them were uploaded as BP. By the way, another high-count high-proportion base-customizing artist is venomous-cookietwt…they also put in their descriptions not to reupload their art, but they don’t have a DNP here.
Mildgyth
Best Pink Pony - For being the first person to reach 50k uploads, managing the site's featured images, and countless other contributions to the site.
Silly Pony - Celebrated the 13th anniversary of MLP:FIM, and 40 years of MLP!
Shimmering Smile - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of Equestria Girls!
Lunar Guardian - Earned a place among the ranks of the most loyal New Lunar Republic soldiers (April Fools 2023).
Roseluck - Had their OC in the 2023 Derpibooru Collab.
King Sombra - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of The Crystal Empire!
A Lovely Nightmare Night - Celebrated the 12th anniversary of MLP:FIM!
Princess of Love - Extra special version for those who participated in the Canterlot Wedding 10th anniversary event by contributing art.
Elements of Harmony - Had an OC in the 2022 Community Collab
Non-Fungible Trixie -

Senior Moderator
Humata, Hukhta, Hvarshta
And, like I said, in the case of this specific artist, it might be better to make sure that the artists whose work was used is properly credited on those images, and to ask the uploaders of this artist to do a better job of making sure they copy the descriptions as a part of the upload and credit the bases who were used.
I’ve checkd the original descriptions on DA - most of the time, there’s nothing there, just information about commissioners and base creators.
Background Pony #E408
I’ve checkd the original descriptions on DA - most of the time, there’s nothing there, just information about commissioners and base creators.
That’s…exactly the point?
Ciaran
ラ・ゼッタ - For supporting the site
Silly Pony - Celebrated the 13th anniversary of MLP:FIM, and 40 years of MLP!
Shimmering Smile - Celebrated the 10th anniversary of Equestria Girls!
Lunar Guardian - Earned a place among the ranks of the most loyal New Lunar Republic soldiers (April Fools 2023).
Crystal Roseluck - Had their OC in the 2023 Derpibooru Collab.
Flower Trio - Helped others get their OC into the 2023 Derpibooru Collab.
A Lovely Nightmare Night - Celebrated the 12th anniversary of MLP:FIM!
Princess of Love - Extra special version for those who participated in the Canterlot Wedding 10th anniversary event by contributing art.
Tree of Harmony - Drew someone's OC for the 2022 Community Collab
Elements of Harmony - Had an OC in the 2022 Community Collab

Senior Moderator
友情は魔法だ
After much alternating between thinking about how to fix this, or whether to fix this, and sometimes completely ignoring it, I have a couple thoughts.
  1. If we added the ‘base used’ implication, then it would not be retroactive - we would still need to add it to all the previous images, which even with bulk tagging would be a huge project. Maybe it could be done with a script.
  2. From a takedown/copyright perspective, it’s better to have the base creator’s tag and the tag of whichever artist’s original work they worked from than ‘base used’. That might be useful, but it would also be an enormous project. Unless maybe it could be scripted (ex: eat the source, wrapper the DA page and grab the base information, compare the base name against those who are the ‘end of the line’ for copyright versus those that are unknown or know to require additional work, tag the image and hand off the exceptions to a human).
  3. Leaving it as it is does, ironically, match our existing practices - that this artist is tracing or recoloring bases only becomes a problem when it becomes a problem, such as when the creator of the image they are tracing or recoloring objects.
@Mildgyth
What do you think? Is this worth creating a project and maybe getting a couple people working it? Or is there a simpler or better solution that I’m not seeing?
@Background Pony #E408
Would you be interested in reviewing all of this artist’s images and documenting the base artist?
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