Rule #0 Policy Refinement Feedback Thread

Lisboeta
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

@Princess Luna  
All the previous wordings has been made by you and (according to the majority of the people who cared to respond)has been weirdly\inconsistently applied according to the results from the polls.
 
I do not want to sound antagonistic but there is no special reason to trust the strength of the wording now.
Background Pony #C551
@Princess Luna  
That’s it confirmed, everyone. This guy’s being forced into this and fed answers.
 
Why would anyone believe that YOU, of all people, think that being the one to make sure that “deletions are methodical” would be comforting considering how openly biased you’ve personally been the entire time?
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Undesirable
@Background Pony #5C8B
The proposed new rules look good.
It’s the examples of application of said rules given by Princess Luna that are worrying people. Me included.
 
Basically me
 
We were all worried about consistency, and almost immediately, the first test regarding how fairly these will be applied showed up and, well, it does not bode well for the future if that’s any example to go by
Background Pony #5C8B
Can everyone calm down for a second and realize this:
 
Even if you do see flaws in the new rules and feel like they are applied arbitrary,  
can’t you all at least agree about the positive side of the new rules?
 
If nothing else, it’s better to have at least SOME hate speech / racism / nazi propaganda arts to be removed, then NONE at all, as it was with the old rule.
 
That’s the positive side of things, that you all must agree upon, instead of being all negative about it.
Background Pony #3ED3
@Background Pony #5149  
Allow me to propose an accurate change to bulletpoint 1:
 
Do not post content whose only apparent purpose is inciting anger, arguments, or controversy. This rule does not apply to things we like, even if they get hundreds of people fighting about them
Princess Luna
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@aperture_tech  
Asking the rest of staff is a bare minimum, and I think one staff member will be assigned as a sort of defense lawyer (to argue against deletion for each image). I’m not sure about details beyond that right now, but some kind of thread logging things publicly might be in the cards.
 
@Background Pony #F329  
No.
Background Pony #9133
The image itself would be looked at in isolation (not the artist, not the votes, not the comments) and it’d be looked at whether it has artistic reasons, or if the art there is just in service of some message that would likely make the average person react angrily, especially things to do with current events that are shocking etc.
 
Oh, so you’re going to be banning all BLM and ACAB art then?  
Or are you now going to deny that it isn’t an insanely divisive topic that causes anger?
Background Pony #C551
@Background Pony #5C8B  
No? The old rule allowed for all of this to be uploaded just fine. It changed when the staff implemented a forced filter so that people couldn’t downvote images in certain tags and has spiraled further and further into censoring and controlling the users ever since.  
The rules’ wording doesn’t matter when it’s not being fairly applied and the staff is actively defending images that break the rules by the same standards as ones they deem against them.
Lisboeta
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

@Background Pony #F329  
If they really go by the US standard of “incitement” almost anything threatening that does not specify specific targets or a course of action if going to be fine.
 
While this is not an optimal rule IMO, I’m OK with that, if only they could extend those hands-off policy to other matters
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@Princess Luna  
Hm, seems fair. That said, if an image is of a somewhat of a high artistic standard, would that be considered in evaluating if the only purpose was inciting anger?
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@Princess Luna  
The fact that you are willing to defend an image that directly calls for the murder of police by hiding behind technicalities, and the fact that a majority of staff ruled it completely fine, makes me question my trust in you and the staff as a whole.
Flagrus

Manet immutabile fatum
@Moonatik
The image itself would be looked at in isolation (not the artist, not the votes, not the comments) and it’d be looked at whether it has artistic reasons, or if the art there is just in service of some message that would likely make the average person react angrily, especially things to do with current events that are shocking etc.
 
Looked at by whom? People who want to find a reason to get mad at an image will always find one, regardless of artist, votes etc. You’d have to literally look inside the artists head to find the true intentions behind the picture
Background Pony #F329
@Princess Luna  
Then i’m really confused as to what you meant when you referred to US law on incitement.  
“Fuck cops” next to a severed pigs head which the character is clearly implied to have eaten through is pretty close to “Kill cops.”
 
@Lisboeta  
See above, the image is pretty clearly calling for violence against cops.
Background Pony #C551
@ArmadilloEater  
Like I’ve been saying, I just can’t allow myself to believe that he’s willingly saying and doing this without being pressured to push the rules and their application in a certain direction.  
The stuff he’s saying just doesn’t make any sense.
Moonatik
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Looked at by whom? People who want to find a reason to get mad at an image will always find one, regardless of artist, votes etc. You’d have to literally look inside the artists head to find the true intentions behind the picture
 
This is my primary concern, right now. Intent cannot be determined as it can only be known by the creator, and can only be guessed (no matter how educated that guess) by onlookers. Therefore, what I think should matter is the impact an image has. If it makes the vast majority of people who view it happy or horny then I don’t see a problem. I believe it was for this purpose that the hide button was created, no?
Flagrus

Manet immutabile fatum
@Background Pony #F329  
This is the exact reason why it’s literally impossible to find an objective legal standard for anything that even remotely has something to do with art. Art and it’s interpretations are one of the most subjective things there are.
Background Pony #5737
@SigmasonicX  
One thing to understand is that ACAB imagery is inherently harassing. I don’t care if it’s sexy or if it’s “just a joke”, the use of ACAB and their symbols in and of itself is an attack on people’s protected characteristics. Could I trust someone to use ACAB in a way that’s just a joke without questioning their intentions? Sure. That doesn’t apply to anyone here. The images posted on this site and the comments in every single one of these threads shows beyond the benefit of doubt that no one on this site can be trusted to use ACAB imagery for jokes.
 
Please understand that there is no level at which using a ACAB pony or ACAB symbols is fine. Stop waffling about whether it’s only bad if it explicitly calls for murder or whatever. Any amount of ACAB is harassing and painful.
Lisboeta
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

@Datte-Before-Dawn  
When the very first examples of things to be deleted trotted out by the administration are so … questionably under any of the bulletpoints it’s hard to say how good or bad those rules are because I am not sure what they would in practice mean.
 
If you allow me an analogue some states criminalize blasphemy. You have an idea what a word “blasphemy” means however it would be imprudent to suppose what exactly is illegal in those countries, you’d need local police instructions, or newspapers, not an Oxford Dictionary.
Background Pony #C551
@Moonatik  
I’m aware that the staff wouldn’t do this for obvious reasons, but that doesn’t work because it allows for distasteful fetishes such as diapers and gore to be booted due to being disliked by the majority of viewers.  
“Artistic merit” is nothing more than an excuse to remove content the judge doesn’t like.
Background Pony #5E8B
Therefore, what I think should matter is the impact an image has. If it makes the vast majority of people who view it happy or horny then I don’t see a problem. I believe it was for this purpose that the hide button was created, no?
 
In an ideal world this would be the only metric in this entire shitshow. Aryanne pics get high upvotes - your community obviously likes it, so let it stay. It hasn’t been a problem for the 8 years this site has been up and it doesn’t suddenly become a problem because a handful of moral busybodies deem it so.
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