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Don't blame me, I voted for the other guy. (Politics General)

NitroFury
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Christmas 2021
A lot people say the Justice System here in America is a colossal mess, but at least we’re not like Japan where you can be convicted of a crime. Like seriously, look up the conviction rate for Japan, holy Christ on a Bike.
Wiimeiser
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(Foil Hat)
@Goku Black
IIRC Phoenix Wright is an exaggerated but more positively inclined version of the Japanese justice system. If Phoenix Wright was a real person, he’d hold the record for most convictions overturned in a Japanese court by a single defense attorney. Take the number of cases in the franchise and subtract 0.5 for Matt Engarde.
Background Pony #F7DA
You called us “death worshippers” and then proceeded to call for a massacre of conservatives. I have nothing polite to say to you, so won’t interact with you at all.
Sounds like you’re afraid to have this conversation. A Background Pony managed to bring proof that your side throws out death threats like complimentary restaurant mints, and all you wanna do is pound your fists and focus on me in particular.
Considering that you ostensibly did call for the “mass murder of conservatives”, and that you in no way denied any such thing of the like being what you said, there, I’m just going to leave these posts from one of the mods dating back to the very early days of this thread (both of which somehow have never lost any of their relevance, nor accuracy), in response:
@Archonix
Lemme try an allegorical version.
@Violet Rose in The Rain
You want to create a system where ideas can be suppressed.
And yet you do not understand that this system will then be used against you and anyone that disagrees with whoever takes control of that power to control speech.
You’re creating the monster that will destroy you after it has destroyed your enemies.
@Violet Rose in The Rain
You seem to be under the impression that letting people speak is an issue.
No.
Letting them speak unchallenged is the issue.
If you are scared that their influence will grow, then build arguments against them. Convince people that their view is bullshit. Create a movement that will grow faster than your opponent. Be better than them.
If you HAVE to resort to violence or suppression to win an argument, then you have already lost.
I really don’t think that there’s anything more that needs to be said, here.
HorsesandMuchMOAR
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Gallusposting since 2019
I read in the news and the radio this morning that vegetable and chicken prices went up in Malaysia due to supply disruptions caused by the pandemic.
Will the prices continue to shoot up and make like worse for the poor, or will the Malaysian government do something to make the prices go down?
I also wonder will this COVID inflation/supply chain disruption be permanent, causing everything to become expensive?
Fuck COVID inflation, and anyone who supports inflation and the free market in general! They have no concern for the poor!
Background Pony #8FB6
@HorsesandMuchMOAR
Prices for a lot of foodstuffs have gone up everywhere. Particularly fowl, of which there’s been a shortage in the US for over a year now partly due to Covid, and in the practical rest of the world now due to massive cullings to stop the spread of a new avian flu strain.
Prices and rent will only continue to rise at an accelerated rate while wages continue to stagnate. Meanwhile the rich just get richer off everyone else’s compounding miseries.
The only thing in this retched economic system that trickles down is debt.
HorsesandMuchMOAR
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Gallusposting since 2019
There has to be a way to stop this! I don’t want to see a world where people become so poor, they become more like slaves - as if wage slavery isn’t enough!
I might sound like a doomsayer (especially to pro-capitalist Americans here), but I want this inflation to stop so the poor will be better off, instead of being threatened to starve.
Violet Rose in The Rain
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

If you are scared that their influence will grow, then build arguments against them. Convince people that their view is bullshit. Create a movement that will grow faster than your opponent. Be better than them.
The fact that over 700k American people died from COVID because a vast majority of them decided not to take free vaccines, wear masks or practice social distancing makes this even funnier.
People on social media platforms such as Reddit and Twitter have been making calls for others to take such safety measures, but the spread of anti-vax, COVID denial and misinformation propaganda on platforms such as r/NoNewNormal and Facebook have made it much harder to deprogram those who already brought into it.
And they definitely aren’t willing to listen, we’ve been trying. My problem is that hateful and bigoted messages are platformed so that they reach a larger audience. For instance, social media.
If you’re just standing in the street corner saying racist stuff, that’s one thing. But if you’re on Twitter saying racist stuff, which is broadcasted to many millions of people, that’s a problem. Even worse if you’re on television doing the same thing. This has the potential to influence vulnerable people into thinking that these are acceptable opinions, since they are allowed to be platformed like other opinions. This is bad. And that’s why I have a problem with it.
This reminds me of a trans friend of mine. While on a college campus they heard someone express transphobic views and were scared. They feared being assaulted. And they told me how they felt scared to attend events or be visibly queer on campus.
When you allow hate speech you don’t get neutrality. People are afraid of being in a space where people who want to hurt them are allowed to openly talk about that. Soon all you are left with is the bigots.
Violet Rose in The Rain
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

The thing is racism and white supremacy don’t respond to debate, because they’re not based on logic to begin with. Both ideologies are based on ideas that can easily be disproven with even basic research, but that people who subscribe to them either are unwilling to hear information that counters them or don’t care that they might be wrong. You can spend hours telling a racist that their views on “race realism” are provably incorrect, but that doesn’t matter if they just reject any information that doesn’t confirm their worldview. Moreover, the fascist or racist can just keep on throwing out shitty untrue claims until they hit on something that their opponent doesn’t know how to address. Even if the fascist/racist’s claim is still inaccurate, and even if they’ve been proven completely wrong dozens of times up to that point, they tend to walk away from that final gotcha exchange feeling victorious, leaving them reaffirmed in their beliefs.
Adding to this, publicly debating racists and fascists creates a real risk of spreading both ideologies. By having a public debate, you implicitly signal that this is an issue with two potentially legitimate sides, when that isn’t the case. It would be like having a serious debate on whether the earth was flat or round, it only legitimizes the side that deserves no legitimacy. Adding to that, public debates give viewers the impression that racism/fascism might be relatively normal parts of society, or at least more acceptable than they had thought. This allows hateful speakers to begin pulling more people to their cause, people who might be prejudiced but otherwise never would have done so.
So what do we do about fascists and racists? We deny them a platform to speak to the masses and socially reaffirm that both ideas are unacceptable. Bigotry thrives in mutually supportive bubbles, where hateful people reinforce each other’s hateful beliefs, and dies in isolation, when people are constantly challenging that hate. If someone still wants to publicly espouse hateful rhetoric they can, but I would bet you the world that less will do so when they aren’t able to see their beliefs publicly presented as having legitimacy or when they’re not able to easily connect with groups of similarly hateful peers.
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@lonewolf
And I thought I was stupid for raising all my own meat. It’s really paying off now, god damn. And I swear the pork I traded for was given as a bona fide gift tastes way better than the store-bought stuff.
@Background Pony #F7DA
You said it way better and more politely than I could have. Thanks for reading back that far; it’s absurd this has been going on for so long.
HorsesandMuchMOAR
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Gallusposting since 2019
I propose that we should lock up fascists in massive deradicalisation centres, and treat them all like terrorists. Many US terrorists tend to practice fascist views, so we should ban fascism completely instead of even allow people to promote it. That should also extend to anyone who promotes authoritarian views, like Stalinism, Wahhabism, Christian/Muslim/Hindu fundamentalism, and Juche.
The US needs a massive deradicalisation programme, especially with the anti-vaxxer and alt-right movements being rampant no thanks to its excessive “freedom of speech”, and people living in fear of racist mobs, harassment, and lone wolves. Perhaps we should use the same level of tolerance as in South Korea, Malaysia (where I live), and Singapore to root out extremism - a bit lesser to eradicate destructive views from society so no one will risk themselves being a threat by picking up extreme views.
By the way, what would you propose as a solution to the post-Covid price hikes in food, caused by low manpower and supply chain disruptions due to the pandemic lockdowns? And will the price hikes be permanent or temporary?
YourPalContrail
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This reminds me of a trans friend of mine. While on a college campus they heard someone express transphobic views and were scared. They feared being assaulted. And they told me how they felt scared to attend events or be visibly queer on campus.
When you allow hate speech you don’t get neutrality. People are afraid of being in a space where people who want to hurt them are allowed to openly talk about that. Soon all you are left with is the bigots.
I often find that the solution to that often is to be friendly with that person from my experience. A lot or the hate comes from an ignorance of an other and if you want to dismantle the hate you must remove the ignorance. that and once you do become friends with them it becomes incredibly difficult for them that when they say those things they know they’re attacking a friend of theirs.
personally I think the rounding up of people and “re-educating them” sounds absolutely horrifying. not only because it ges against the American ideals of free expression but because historically, that method was used against the innocent as well such as under McCarthyism.
Violet Rose in The Rain
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

For one, that puts the burden on the minority to remain in contact with the person they’re trying to rehabilitate. This means that they have to expend a lot of mental and emotional energy* trying to explain to said subject why holding such views will harm minority demographics. It might not even work if the person isn’t willing to listen or change their views, which leads to my next point.
It’s not uncommon to say, for example, white supremacists to take a minority friend they know and mentally distance them from the demographic they’re bigoted against, saying that their friend is “one of the good ones,” such as Blaire White and Candace Owens with the Alt-right. In such an event, changing one’s opinion of a single person is easier than getting rid of their bigotry.
And in an era with rising hate crimes and where people are still getting killed for their identity (Arbery, Trans Panic Defence, the Christchurch shooting), I don’t blame minorities for not risking their necks to put themselves in contact with someone that wants them dead, for the probability of rehabilitation that might not even happen anyway.
*And considering the widening gap between the ultra-rich and the poor in America, most are living paycheck to paycheck and are one financial crisis from becoming homeless. Prioritising their own survival is understandable in a time like this, especially with COVID.
Ebalosus
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Zipp is g5 BP
>alt-right
>rampant
Most of the who’s who of the alt-right’s figureheads either sold out and became boomer conservatives (Bannon and Spencer) or were revealed to be epic grifters (Cernovich). The rest of them are akin to modern sincere GamerGate people, in that they spend all their time whining online instead of trying to bring about the change they want to see.
And no, MAGAchuds aren’t in-and-of-themselves alt-right, as they subscribe to QAnonism, and not race-science.
HorsesandMuchMOAR
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Gallusposting since 2019
Another thing: as prices of food are going up due to the COVID outbreak disrupting transport, will this pass and prices go down one day, or keep going on for years?
I am worried that poorer people won’t be able to afford food if this inflation keeps going on.
Thirdly, many leftists (like Violet on this thread) in the US suggest that racism and fascism (including the now-weakened alt-right) are rampant threats in US society, and people who practice these views should be punished by being isolated. So they suggest “punch Nazis!” to make gay people feel safer.
Do you think fascism and racism are that powerful as a force in US society? Or is it a leftist equivalent of QAnon?
Violet Rose in The Rain
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

I propose that we should lock up fascists in massive deradicalisation centres, and treat them all like terrorists. Many US terrorists tend to practice fascist views, so we should ban fascism completely instead of even allow people to promote it. That should also extend to anyone who promotes authoritarian views, like Stalinism, Wahhabism, Christian/Muslim/Hindu fundamentalism, and Juche.
The US needs a massive deradicalisation programme, especially with the anti-vaxxer and alt-right movements being rampant no thanks to its excessive “freedom of speech”, and people living in fear of racist mobs, harassment, and lone wolves. Perhaps we should use the same level of tolerance as in South Korea, Malaysia (where I live), and Singapore to root out extremism - a bit lesser to eradicate destructive views from society so no one will risk themselves being a threat by picking up extreme views.
By the way, what would you propose as a solution to the post-Covid price hikes in food, caused by low manpower and supply chain disruptions due to the pandemic lockdowns? And will the price hikes be permanent or temporary?
Tax the rich. If Bezos can afford to ride a giant dick into space while his workers are working on minimum wage or less, he can afford pay what he’s been skimping out on.
YourPalContrail
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For one, that puts the burden on the minority to remain in contact with the person they’re trying to rehabilitate. This means that they have to expend a lot of mental and emotional energy* trying to explain to said subject why holding such views will harm minority demographics. It might not even work if the person isn’t willing to listen or change their views, which leads to my next point.
I wasn’t implying that trans people have a moral obligation to convert bigots. I was only speaking from experience in my own life when dealing with homophobic people. I wanted to mention it because I do encourage it because I want less homophobic people.
It’s not uncommon to say, for example, white supremacists to take a minority friend they know and mentally distance them from the demographic they’re bigoted against, saying that their friend is “one of the good ones,” such as Blaire White and Candace Owens with the Alt-right. In such an event, changing one’s opinion of a single person is easier than getting rid of their bigotry.
I know that’s very common for them to say and often when they say that I find that is the first step in deradicalizing. for example in Daryl Davis’s interview you hear Robert White, a former KKK dragon for the state of Maryland, say the same thing about Deryl Davis. As for Candace Owens and Blair White I do disagree with a lot of their views but on a bare minimum level if they are exposing the alt right to black people and trans people I’d say that at the very least is a good thing, though I am skeptical that a parasocial relationship can truly convert someone, which is why I encourage talking to them.
And in an era with rising hate crimes and where people are still getting killed for their identity (Arbery, Trans Panic Defence, the Christchurch shooting), I don’t blame minorities for not risking their necks to put themselves in contact with someone that wants them dead, for the probability of rehabilitation that might not even happen anyway.
again I never implied that minorities have a moral duty to convert people. I was only speaking from personal experience of dealing with homophobic people in my personal life. I was hoping that you would understand that. I hope that you and I both wat the same goal of less bigoted people.
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