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Don't blame me, I voted for the other guy. (Politics General)

Background Pony #7E8D
@Background Pony #9659
Your sarcastic response only works if you acknowledge that the overall logic behind the point I've conveyed to you actually cuts both ways, regardless of which side of the political spectrum is on the business end of the point's edge.
Background Pony #9659
@Background Pony #7E8D
Like how civil things were when JFK was shot? Or when Reagan was shot? Or when the Oklahoma federal building was blown up? Or when Nixon very civilly spied on political opponents then dragged the credibility of the US government through the mud for a year? Or when Boehner and Graham and McConnell and every other career GOP politician pretended the US democracy was dead because they failed to kick out Clinton after impeaching him over a blowjob?

What sort of "evidence" are you looking for? That people weren't posting mean things on Twitter in 1996? Have a look through political cartoons, editorials, readers' letters, etc. Shit hasn't changed, it's just now you're more aware of it, and more importantly, currently living through it.
Background Pony #9659
@Background Pony #7E8D
@Background Pony #9659
Your sarcastic response only works if you acknowledge that the overall logic behind the point I've conveyed to you actually cuts both ways, regardless of which side of the political spectrum is on the business end of the point's edge.

Except I don't have to at all, because the point of my post wasn't to go all "both sides are bad", but to point out that silbasa's "only the side I don't like is bad" is flawed.

You feel like of those people that can't help but say "all lives matter" when seeing someone say "black lives matter". Or that go on about the evils of communism whenever someone says fascism is bad.
Background Pony #7E8D
@Ciaran
That is correct, and I am not the one who made the claim that things "weren't "more civil" back then". That would be Ereiam of whom you're referring to:

@Ereiam
@Background Pony #7E8D
Or it is a comment on how moronic it is to pretend that things used to be more civil "back then".


Which means that by your logic, he should be the one providing the proof for this claim of his.


And if you're saying that if his claim is a negative, then the burden of proof does not fall on him, then how exactly, in this specific situation, is this sentence relevant or warranted to be looked at in any way?

The burden of proof is on the claimant, not those disputing the claim.



That makes zero sense.
Background Pony #9659
@Background Pony #7E8D
@Ciaran
That is correct, and I am not the one who made the claim that things "weren't "more civil" back then". That would be Ereiam of whom you're referring to:

@Ereiam
@Background Pony #7E8D
Or it is a comment on how moronic it is to pretend that things used to be more civil "back then".


Which means that by your logic, he should be the one providing the proof for this claim of his.


That's a nice way to completely obviate this little jewel Eriam was responding to:
@silbasa
It was not always like this. In ages past it was possible to have a discussion. The two sides in western countries were not as far apart in the past. Then we entered the current era of hyper offensiveness, political correctness and identity politics. Debate is no longer possible on many subjects and any attempts to talk quickly evolves into a metaphorical fecal matter slinging championship in minutes. Hyper toxicity and personal attacks are methods of our time. The subversion of democracy runs deep.

So, Silbasa makes a claim, Eriam contests it, and according to you the burden of proof is on Eriam for contesting it on not the person making the claim.

I feel like maybe there's some sort of bias going on here, hrmm.
Ciaran
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友情は魔法だ🧚
@Background Pony #7E8D
I'm honestly not surprised to hear you say that.

I'm also not surprised you picked your own 'original statement that needs to be proven".

But since the beginning of this current discussion all the examples provided have pointed out examples of how the original premise is flawed, if not outright wrong. And you pick someone in the middle of the mess to demand proof from.

So, combined with your other posting history on this site, it sure looks like you're just here to troll the thread, and trolling this thread is a bannable offense.

Just remember this is a containment zone, not a philosophy class. No one owes you perfect proof of anything. And you are never, ever, going to receive anything even remotely approaching "indisputable evidence" of any premise.

So if you are trolling, leave. And if you are going to stay, stop demanding the impossible.
CaptainXtra

El Paso Resident
So, do the majority of users here agree that the EU's bureaucracy system is at least as flawed and questionable as yee old Murica?

I won't ever deny that Spineless Corporate Dems and Bible Humping Repubs commonly fuck over progress on this side of the pond.
Background Pony #9659
@CaptainXtra
The primary problem with the EU system is most people living in the EU don't realise it even exists. EU parliament elections get very little coverage or fanfare, from news or the parties themselves, and the activities of the cameras are barely covered in the news because they don't feel direct enough (they happen in a Brussels, involve a whole lot of unknown officials, and take years to go from EU regulation to actual laws).

The problem lies less with the system (which is just really similar to the US one) and in its perception inside the EU itself as "foreign". It leads to people voting against their best interests (if they vote at all) because they don't look up what the party platforms actually are at the EU scale, just their local scale.
AaronMk
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#Turmoil2020's
@Penguin Dragneel
@Ereiam
The only reason things seemed to be civil back then was because of moral guardians censoring anything remotely progressive, meaning many people didn't know about the other side.


Just say The State

It's just The State

There weren't ever any sacred arbiters. Just the ruling class acting on consensus.
CaptainXtra

El Paso Resident
@Background Pony #9659
EU citizens are ignorant when compared to Yankee folks.

For every Yellow Vest and STOPACTA2 protester you have a hundred average joes and janes who don’t even know how the EU functions.

I’m sorry but that’s what I see.

If a regulation like the TERREG got approved in the US without a vote you’d see BLM and maybe even Jan 6th Capitol storming levels of unrest 24/7.

US citizens response to terrible decisions/laws made by Government powers:



EU citizens response to same things:

Background Pony #7EFA
@CaptainXtra
It isn't limited to just the EU. It's perfectly rational for the majority of people to be ignorant to politics. It takes a lot of work to be informed and when you are the power you wield as an individual is little. Twitter does a great job of showing this since it's so easy for people to flaunt that ignorance, people can just post or comment on whatever thing comes to mind, then other people will link to whatever dumb thing is posted to show how uninformed the poster is, while being no better.
DarkBrawlerCF1994

Then there’s the factor of how much outrage has been generated for years.

We dealt with constant pedophilia scandals, sheer douchebaggery of some rotten creators, the childish fits of Republicuck politicians, and So. Much. More!

You can’t blame social media for missing out on something worth getting livid over. There’s simply too much shit going on lately, no thanks to Corona.
Background Pony #7E8D
@Background Pony #9659
the point of my post wasn't to go all "both sides are bad", but to point out that silbasa's "only the side I don't like is bad" is flawed.


Then you might wanna do a better job of conveying your points, next time, because that was not the jist of it that I got from your post.


If anything, it looked more like if you were actively ignoring how the point of your post could cut both ways, rather than you just criticizing silbasa.



You feel like of those people that can't help but say "all lives matter" when seeing someone say "black lives matter". Or that go on about the evils of communism whenever someone says fascism is bad.


I find it rather interesting that you're acting like know everything about me, when in fact, you don't. (I'm not trying to troll here, by the way. I just find it to be utterly bemusing that someone would think that they know anything about a total stranger more than the stranger themself.)



@Background Pony #7E8D
Like how civil things were when JFK was shot? Or when Reagan was shot? Or when the Oklahoma federal building was blown up? Or when Nixon very civilly spied on political opponents then dragged the credibility of the US government through the mud for a year? Or when Boehner and Graham and McConnell and every other career GOP politician pretended the US democracy was dead because they failed to kick out Clinton after impeaching him over a blowjob?


Do you even know what a strawman is? I have ever once said or implied that none of these things have ever happened, or that there were zero instances of people not willing to have a rational, "civilized" dialogue prior to the mid 2010s. Are you actually just trying to troll at this point? Because if you are, then as Ciaran informed me, it's a bannable offense.


What sort of "evidence" are you looking for?


Well, for one thing, that there is absolutely zero truth to what silbasa's saying, and that is literally exactly what I mean, word for word.


Have a look through political cartoons, editorials, readers' letters, etc. Shit hasn't changed, it's just now you're more aware of it, and more importantly, currently living through it.


Maybe shit has changed, maybe it hasn't. One thing that is for sure, however, is that I never blindly believe anything practically anyone tells me, simply because they say so—especially not in this day and age.
Background Pony #7E8D
@Ciaran
I'll attempt PM you about this later, because if anything, neither one of us are able to come to an understanding without making assumptions about each other.


Until then, I'll try my best to follow through on these rules that you've laid out for this thread to see, even if they may not make total sense. Peace ✌.
CaptainXtra

El Paso Resident
@Background Pony #7EFA
@CaptainXtra
It isn't limited to just the EU. It's perfectly rational for the majority of people to be ignorant to politics. It takes a lot of work to be informed and when you are the power you wield as an individual is little. Twitter does a great job of showing this since it's so easy for people to flaunt that ignorance, people can just post or comment on whatever thing comes to mind, then other people will link to whatever dumb thing is posted to show how uninformed the poster is, while being no better.


It also occurred to me, could the Capitol Riot here in the US pretty much had given the EU all the justification it needed to pass the TERREG without a vote?

Trump and his cronies inciting violence on Twitter probably gave the bureaucrats in the EU plenty of ammunition to get that shit through.

“See what happened in the US a while back? This regulation will help prevent that kind of thing from happening here!” -Some EU politician.
Ciaran
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友情は魔法だ🧚
@Background Pony #7E8D
Well, for one thing, that there is absolutely zero truth to what silbasa's saying, and that is literally exactly what I mean, word for word.

Silbasa's statement was opinion. Not fact.

Other people disagreeing with Sibasa's opinion are expressions of their own opinions (in some cases with what could be considered supporting examples).

This is a thread for people to discuss their political opinions on a fan-run My Little Pony website.

No one owes you "100% proof" that their opinions are true, and no one has to prove that someone else's opinion is 100% irrefutably wrong in order to disagree.

If that's something you require, or are unwilling to stop demanding from others, then please find a different site to discuss political topics.
Zincy
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Part-time Pizza Cat
A Republican in Idaho raped a women, then tried to cover it up by seeing if he could get her arrested. Failing that, he had his attorney release a memo that named her so that his far-right hit squad of supporters could harass her. She's 19, I believe.


But these Q fucks still think it's the dems who are the kiddie diddlers.
HeadlessHorselessHorseman

@Dustcan
Police shoot and kill a kidnapped 4 month old baby in a shootout with the father over suspected murder.

To be fair, if the baby had only complied then the officers wouldn't have had no choice but to shoot him. But hey, at least the kid ain't kidnapped no more!

And before you ask, of course they were black.

Also,

"Right now our top priority is locating that child safely," Sheriff Sid Gautreaux said Monday.


I'm not sure if the sheriff's department was actually involved in the shooting. And not that it makes it much better, but it's quite possible the suspect shot first or suddenly tried to use his son as a human shield when he was cornered. Got to say, though, the police department's refusal to release the info on who fired the initial shot doesn't fill me with confidence.
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