Don't blame me, I voted for the other guy. (Politics General)

IWTCIEM

@Background Pony #0E9C
You attack me for hating the US, but it is for very valid reasons; the frequent mass shootings being just one of them. Innocent men, women and children are dying and instead you’re gaslighting me into thinking my anger isn’t called for. I don’t want to hear excuses on the other side. I want solutions, and ones which actually work. At this point I’m done hearing conservative talking points such as “good guys with guns” or “shall not be infringed.” The country has been kowtowing to extremist gun hoarders for way too long. If you’re more offended by my choice of wording than you are of mass murders, that’s on you, not me.
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Ebalosus
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Ok, that’s insane, but lets play out how such an idea would work: say Biden goes to the UN and asks for help disarming the Wolverine-Americans and associated LARPers, and the UN agrees in principle to help. How do they actually do that? Unlike what paranoid rightoids assume, the UN doesn’t have an army, so it’ll be up to its members to basically invade the most powerful empire in human history in order to disarm a good third of the population. Lets look at our options:
-China? They’re the closest in terms of absolute military power, but they wouldn’t be onboard with that due to them being on everyone’s shitlist for the Uyghur genocide.
-Russia? They would certainly like to punish the Americans for intervening in their elections in the 90s and for all the sanctions, but they wouldn’t be onboard due to them being on everyone’s shitlist for invading Ukraine.
-America’s European allies? They’re too concerned about Russia escalating a military conflict with the rest of the continent due to their invasion of Ukraine.
-America’s Middle-Eastern allies? They’re too concerned about each other and/or Russia to spare troops for such an endeavour.
-America’s Latin-American allies? They’re more concerned with their internal affairs to worry about sending troops to America.
-Canada? A redux of the War of 1812 would be pretty funny, but I don’t think Canadians by-and-large would be onboard with such an endeavour, despite outside appearances (In case you aren’t aware, despite the bluster Canada tows the US line through thick and thin).
-Africa? They’re more concerned with internal affairs and using their very limited resources to those ends than something on the other side of the world [to them].
-America’s Asian allies? They’re too concerned about China going all Russia on Taiwan, thus wouldn’t want to spare troops for some internal American matter.
-India? Ditto about China and concerned about what Pakistan is up to.
-Oceania? Australia is more concerned about China and New Zealand doesn’t have the military to contribute to such an endeavour.
Even disregarding the fact that such an endeavour would at best be a repeat of the Coalition’s efforts in Afghanistan (with the same outcomes), you would have terrible trouble getting such an initiative off the ground to begin with. It’s one area where I begrudgingly respect the foreign policy blob: They’ve worked the system to such a way that invading America is off the table for anyone with the wherewithal to do so.
Latecomer

Yeah… if the police and National Guard and even the military if need be can’t do it, the UN couldn’t do much to practically help. Their only advantage would be being less likely to sabotage the process via Second Amendment sympathies, but that’s offset by the massive negative PR of being foreign troops on American soil. And what happens when (as is inevitable) some of them are shot?
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Suidian
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@NitroFury
We wouldn’t have as much gun violence, not just school shootings, if there were more regulations on owning weapons. The NRA and Republicans who defend the “right to bear arms” are just as much at fault.
The second amendment was created during a time when guns weren’t full-auto death machines, and America had no standing army and called on its people to defend the country, not to mention the fact that most people hunted back then and needed guns to feed their families anyway. Nowadays if there is a threat to the country, the government doesn’t call on us to defend it, they have the military and the national guard. There’s no need nowadays for people to own guns, or at least not a damn AR.
And even then, citing the Constitution and acting like it’s an infallible document is simply foolish. For example, when it was written, the Constitution allowed slavery and prevented women from voting. Since the Constitution said it was right, did that mean we had to go along with that? Of fucking course not.
A person should have a license to own a gun, like owning a car - it makes no sense that we need to prove that we’re responsible enough to drive when we can just go to any gun store as long as we’re 18 and buy a gun. You also shouldn’t be able to do it at 18. The legal age of being considered an adult in America actually used to be 21 until it was lowered to 18 to gain more manpower for foreign conflicts anyway.
Rifles should also be far more heavily regulated. I think someone should have actual professional gun training like in the military before they’re allowed to buy an assault rifle at any gun store.
My rant was probably a lot longer than necessary and I bet that a lot of people on here are going to disagree with me, but I stick firm to my beliefs, and I’m fucking tired of people and politicians only responding to gun violence with “tHoUgHtS aNd PrAyErS.” Thoughts and prayers aren’t going to stop this shit from happening again.
Background Pony #EC7E
the Democrats are losing momentum in this country because they’re not strong enough. They think they can peacefully negotiate with a terrorist/extremist party and its equally violent voter base. And they’ve proven themselves to be weak in the face of Republican attacks. Even President Biden is being viewed unfavorably by gun control advocates because he isn’t doing shit.
Don’t confuse Republican obstinance with strength. The fact that they outright refuse to have anything to do with legislation that involves gun control is the issue here. And as long as the filibuster exists, it’s unfortunately not something the Democrats can really do anything about.
But thanks almost entirely to staunch Republican opposition in Congress, Biden’s agenda to curb gun violence and reduce access to firearms has been mostly confined to a series of executive actions. Those actions can make a tangible difference, gun-control advocates argue, but aren’t as far reaching as measures that must pass through Congress before becoming law.
Despite being the minority party on Capitol Hill, Republicans can still block most bills in Congress because of a Senate rule known as the filibuster, which requires 60 votes to break. Effectively, that means Democrats would need to win support from at least 10 Republican senators to pass gun-control legislation.
And Biden is still trying to do some things in regards to gun control. He recently announced new regulations on “ghost guns”, and his administration is also working on finalizing a regulation on stabilizing pistol braces.


@Ebalosus
when the opposition has all the guns and the momentum, shouldn’t your side want guns too in order get them to respect you?
I very much doubt it counts as respect if you have to be armed to get it.
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Ebalosus
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First: The NRA is a weaksauce gun ‘rights’ organisation, which is hated by just as many pro-gun people as anti-gun people.
Second: You’d need to overturn Warren v. District of Columbia and Town of Castle Rock v. Gonzales to force the police to have a legal obligation to protect people, and are open to both civil and criminal lawsuits should they fail to do so.
Third: IIRC wouldn’t raising the voting age basically kill the democratic majority in nominally solid-blue voting districts?
Suidian
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The NRA is a weaksauce gun ‘rights’ organisation, which is hated by just as many pro-gun people as anti-gun people.
They’re still a contributing factor to the problem, and they’re hardly “weaksauce.”
You’d need to overturn Warren v. District of Columbia* and Town of Castle Rock v. Gonzales to force the police to have a legal obligation to protect people, and are open to both civil and criminal lawsuits should they fail to do so.
I never said it’s the easy thing to do, it’s the right thing to do.
IIRC wouldn’t raising the voting age basically kill the democratic majority in nominally solid-blue voting districts?
I didn’t say that we should raise the voting age, I just used the fact it used to be higher to preemptively shoot down that counter-argument of legal adults who aren’t 21 but can vote should be able to have guns, I guess it wasn’t the best example.
CaptainXtra

KILL THE EARN IT ACT!
I’m somewhat glad that Shotguns aren’t seen as bad as Rifles or Pistols in relation to use in Mass Shootings.
Shotguns, despite their ability to utterly shred anything caught in its crosshairs, (unlike what you see in games, in real life they can actually kill shit well past melee range), are usually defensive type guns and not intended for being offensive in most cases.
Powerful but Reserved.
Atlas_66
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That’s a lot of words just to say “yes, I support razing entire cities to ruble and the mass murder and rape of random civilians”
  • Where did I say that I support the demolition of cities? what’s in your head? Do you even know how to read what I write to you?
    Where are the rapes and killings of civilians? You only know how to balabol but did not give me a single fact.
    Only empty slogans.
    YOU are a victim of propaganda, I congratulate you on this)
Patrick Lancaster..
  • And… is that all? is that all you can say? insert a stupid picture into the quality of the answer as a counterargument?
    Dude, you don’t understand the situation, then shut up and don’t write anything at all) I showed you journalists from the West who work in the Donbass.
    I showed you the journalists who work in the Donbass direction, all that you threw me was a stupid picture)) well, okay.
    If you have nothing to say, you could not waste my time and ignore me next time, okay?
Our growth rate will resume. Your economy will have negative growth.
  • No, it’s certainly fine, the USA is doing well there, everything is bad in Russia - I understand why you say so, but let’s not predict ahead of time?
    Yes, I completely agree that the sanctions imposed by the hypocritical US policy will not lead to anything good, of course, sanctions are bad and the Russian economy will obviously not benefit.
    But how good or bad everything will be, I would not predict.
And I hate to say it lad, your country doesn’t have that much to offer on the world stage other than oil and some metals, so even counter sanctions or knockdown effects won’t have that much of an impact on broader markets.
  • This is all interconnected, and the world economy is already shaking and experiencing not very good trends due to the imposition of sanctions on Russia.
    Gas is supplied to Germany, in Germany, electricity is on gas, because they abandoned nuclear power plants in favor of “ecology” and that’s what happened, the rise in price of electricity, the rise in price of gasoline, and prices in stores grow further along the chain.
    Again, I’m not making any assumptions in advance, I don’t know how it will end, and neither can you.
    Again, the imposition of sanctions on Russia will return to Europe like a boomerang. I don’t say anything about the United States at all, it is most likely the least of all, the United States will not suffer here, but the United States leads Europe like its own dog, and Europe is ready to shoot itself in the foot for the sake of the United States.
    In fact, this is another reason why I consider the USA to be a global evil (not people, but its general hypocritical policy towards other countries)
I know how to properly evaluate the market data coming out of your rapidly closing economy.
  • Well, by the way, I don’t understand anything in economics, so I thank you for the clarification. But then again, I wouldn’t make assumptions about how this will all end, maybe in 2 years everyone will see that only Russia suffers exclusively, and in Europe everything is fine like in the USA, maybe in Europe and Russia it will be bad in terms of the economy, and only in the US and China will be fine.
    Or the whole world will be bad, I don’t know at all)
    I just talked with friends from Germany, from the UK, they all complain about the insane increase in electricity and in general prices in stores.
    And it started just after the sanctions against Russia, and for this reason, no one can refuse gas yet.
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Ebalosus
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Italian comrades have told me about the same issues affecting their country, and are seriously wondering what was even the point of shitcanning Gaddafi, since he could’ve definitely helped ease the dependence on Russian oil and gas.
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IWTCIEM

@CaptainXtra
That might be the case, but one must also keep in mind that most mass shooters specifically use semi-automatic pistols and rifles because they are more efficient at killing large numbers of people. And that’s why they need to be highly regulated and/or confiscated.
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Atlas_66
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@Ebalosus
I don’t have friends in Italy, but I saw a photo from the electric bill, where the prices for electricity are quite gigantic ..
Well, okay, I noticed a price increase in Russia only in stores. I didn’t particularly notice the increase in electricity prices, probably the fact of the use of nuclear power plants, cheap and green energy is involved here)
A peaceful atom is good.
The inscription on the poster “Atoms in the service of peace and progress”
Ebalosus
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Oh I’m super in favour of more nuclear energy, and don’t take any greenie seriously unless they also support nuclear energy.
Also: based and SovietPropagandaPilled. I’m never going to forgive Yeltsin for breaking up the USSR.
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U mad?
Well for starters Democrats could go to the UN and ask for their help in going door to door confiscating guns from all those terrorists. If they’re so crazy about fighting government agents, then let them have it.
Speaking of fascism… that definitely sounds like one of the products of it.
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IWTCIEM

@lonewolf
Prosecuting gun hoarders and far-right terrorists is NOT fascism. It’s a public safety measure. These people (if you can even call them that) think it’s okay for innocent people to be massacred so they can play with their toys. No respect for them or their enablers.
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@Atlas_66
Oh, I could say a lot more, it’s just not worth my time to do so, nor that of anyone’s to read, particularly considering your goal here isn’t to have any sort of actual discussion, just troll)))
@IWTCIEM
Really, really can’t tell if you’re at all serious or just playing the part of the cookie-cutter hysterical leftist rightwingers like to parody to make everyone else left of Romney look insane.
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IWTCIEM

@The Smiling Pony
I’m not LARPing in any way whatsoever. I am simply calling out the severity of the situation and telling it like it is. What gun nuts and their ilk are doing is no different from terrorism. And what I’ve suggested isn’t extreme in any way; UK and Australia for example confiscated guns, with much success. That is a fact.
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@IWTCIEM
That’s the big problem, though: through this admission, you’re actually proving people like TSP and literally every one else in the same boat as him wrong, and the “rightwingers” who “like to parody cookie-cutter hysterical leftists to make everyone else left of Romney look insane” correct, because you are literally admitting to unironically being that “cookie-cutter hysterical leftist” in real life, personified, according to TSP’s logic||—and this should mean something to you, considering how towering of a figure he is, on this website (the site’s owner, to be exact)||.
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IWTCIEM

@Background Pony #0E9C
Why shouldn’t the left be outraged at what’s happening? The far-right has been clamping down on the rights of LGBT and POC, slaughtering innocent people and promoting violent, unhinged conspiracy theories. By shaming my angry response and equating it to extremists on the other side, you’re sounding just like Trump with his whole “violence on both sides” fallacy. And on top of that you’re flat-out ignoring the reality that gun control works in the rest of the developed nations, which is simply a fact I’ve brought up multiple times, but falls on deaf ears.
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