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I can sort of agree to that, but keep in mind that “Twilight being destined” just felt like more shoehorned nepotism either by Celestia or the writers. Like all the main characters were destined but Twilight had to be doubly destined? Really?
Maybe, but not for the right reasons.
Cozy kidnapped, and trapped Starlight too, AND tried to do the same to the main 6, as well.
So in a way, Starlight already got some punishiment back.
That’s actually why I like Twilight. She’s an example of a character who despite having it all, has always (gradually speaking) chosen to do the right thing or help others. When you think of the snotty spoiled rich popular girls, Twilight doesn’t come to mind, and that’s because she’s the most humble character in the show, in contrast to character with deep backstories
There were some issues yes, but I don’t think Twilight in the same position, since she’s literally destined by the Tree of Harmony to be the Element of Magic. She was shaped and molded by her friends for most of her adult life, and I think she turned out fine
Starlight on the other hand… just felt rushed.
I guess the only justification is that Twilight somehow knew her sincerity, and decided to guilt-trip her into becoming good. (Which holds up given that she’s frequently “Twilighting” as much as she does, AND she’s just a big a cry baby) You could also thrown in Twilight wanted to take a different approach compared to what happened with Trixie.
Upon reflection, pretty sure purple unicorns in this show weren’t allowed to have any real world consequences, responsibilities, or even freakin jobs. Starlight didn’t, Twilight didnt, heck the library was simply assigned to Twilight as a home, no money or job required. Even the friendship school felt more like an experiment then anything they needed income for, including Starlight who otherwise had no job.
And if someone points out Twilight became THE princess of Equestria at the end, I’m pretty sure the boon of being practically a god offsets that responsibility. (Not that anyone in the audiance believed for a moment a brown nose like Twilight was ready for that kind of responsibility when Celestia and Luna retired….)
What was Starlight’s job while she was living in Ponyville just after creating many doomed timelines filled with suffering and all her prior crimes? Nothing? Yeah…And how did her old village react when she came back? Anger? Some cold shoulders? No, they were happy to have her back at the beginning of that finale and when she returned at the end of the finale they were also happy to have her back.
Classic hero’s journey….if written by a idiot.
Heck even in the meta episode where the Mane 6 have to admit to the town after their autobiographies were written they still have some of their flaws they started out with, they would often skip Twilight’s flaws.
…
Was it some sort of mandate from the show runners the purple unicorns should never recieve consequences?
Heck after the brainwashing episode POST-reformation I would expect a freeloader like Starlight to be forced to clean the entire castle for a month on principle. What’s the point in a reformation story if the character never has to work for it? What’s the point of having most characters have jobs and responsibilities people can relate to while the main character and her “reformed” apprentice…don’t.
Starlight ran away the first time too even after Twilight gave her little friendship speech. Also if we’re gonna be going over Starlight’s crimes may as well add high treason for kidnapping and imprisoning the Princess of Friendship. Then there’s attempted assault on her villagers.
Enslaving meaning kidnapping, actually magically taking away talents, literally mentally torturing and attempting to brainwash people to see the way she saw. Just calling it a cult is kind of putting it lightly
Though to add to Cozys list of crimes she was attempting to conquer Equestria…like very badly stupendously badly for being depicted as intelligent it really showed she was still a child because her plan made no sense and would fail all on its own
Not really. Twilight just asked her why she did it and said that she was wrong. In no way did she try to tell her why she was wrong or convince her to change. Why would Cozy show remorse when no help is given to her in doing so? Starlight certainly didn’t,
She can refuse, just like Discord but that doesn’t mean that she can’t be given help.
Twilight tried to reason with her too, but Cozy wouldn’t listen, just yelled at her, and tried to escape. Even as she was put in “jail,” she still showed no remorse, nor anything unlike Starlight.
I can understand wanting more chances for Cozy, (and she is just a child, but granted even kids can be murderers, and such) but Cozy still refused to reform.
She enslaved a village, tried to mess with time itself for petty revenge and even after she learned what her actions may cause she still needed convincing to stop and she still almost ripped the scroll. The only reason she surrendered was because Twilight had to convince her to do so. In a sense, she was getting an impromptu reformation attempt, which Cozy never got.
In fairness, Starlight’s only crimes were starting a cult, and messing with time, unaware of the damage it caused. She wasn’t actually trying to conquer, or steal all magic like Cozy was, and Cozy was fully aware of the damage she’d cause, and conspired with Tirek.
So honestly it’s not the same thing. What Cozy did was much worse.
And unlike Cozy, Starlight surrendered, and actually felt remorse.
That makes her even hotter
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LX2VeWumRQ8
Edited
also cozy glow tried stealing all the magic to become the complete ruler of Equestria (she said “Empress of Friendship” but potato, potahtow), then joined up with King Magic Theft and Queen Love Theft in order to commit regicide or something.
In conclusion, Starlight should’ve gotten more than a slap on the wrist and Cozy Glow should’ve received a punishment that didn’t basically kill her. Chryssi and Tirek have a bad rep in Equestria, so hang the SOBs.
Edited
A redemption program would be something like what Discord got, which I think we can both agree is a far better fate then being turned to stone or locked up in a tiny. In what way would that be similar to a Chinese concentration camp? Why do you assume that I want her to be tortured and brainwashed into being good?
She really didn’t. I don’t know how you think that scene even remotely counts as an attempt to reform or reason with her.
And I can call out the show for making a bad, immoral decision in the story that makes the hero’s look like hypocrites. And considering the fact that the CMC came out of the janitor’s room on the next day after the night Cozy was apprehended (unless they spent multiple days in there), I don’t think that they tried too hard with her.
Have you seen the way she acts even on her own? Did you see the temper tantrum she threw in front of Rusty Bucket? She’s obviously an immature child. And manipulator? Yea, she’s pretty good at that but not an infallible one. Again, I’ll mention Rusty Bucket for this. And really, wouldn’t the danger of being a manipulator be the same with adults? At least a child can’t bend reality or teleport away to help her with her manipulations. As for the psycho case, many of the ones that live normal lives are treated since childhood. If anything, the younger you start the better and even then, we don’t know if Cozy really is a psycho. I never said that whoever tries to reform her should throw all caution out the window and just trust her, but the fact that she’s still very young would make things safer.
Yes, that could be a good way to go about it but certainly not the only one.
FORCING someone into a “redemption program” is not “giving them a second chance”, it’s a violation of autonomy. I brought up China is because your terrible ideas about how to change people aren’t just abstract criticisms, it reflects real atrocities in the world. On a side note, if you want a good real life story of redemption watch the documentary “The Redemption of General Butt Naked”. He did far worse things than anyone on My Little Pony did, but he was still given amnesty by Liberia’s truth and reconciliation council because of what he did afterwards.
By the way, your claim that I was the first person to comment in a month is a lie. I commented on the same day as the last person to comment before me. It’s funny that you’re using BGP to hide your identity as you’re doing a REALLY bad job at it. You keep injecting the same points at the same time on multiple different images that have no real bearing with what is going on in the specific conversation, making it clear you’re just putting it out as it comes to your mind. Thing is, I like discussing these things, but just repeating the same points isn’t a discussion, it’s just wasting both of our time. I don’t know about you, but I work from home so I have more important things to do than endlessly repeat myself. It takes a certain degree of maturity to recognize when a conversation is going nowhere because two people are not going to see eye to eye on certain things and to then call it quits. If the discussion keeps moving I’ll keep participating, if it’s not I’ll call it out for what it is.
Twilight did try, she just failed. END OF DISCUSSION.
As I stated, they maybe could have done the same thing with Cozy Glow as they did with Discord, but they didn’t. That’s how the show was written. Considering that for Discord they did it after he was turned to stone, they can STILL do the same thing they did with her as they did with Discord. As it is though we only have what’s in the show, and that just didn’t happen. As for doing the same thing with Starlight Glimmer, we get Twilight talking to Cozy Glow for a bit, Cozy Glow promising revenge, Cozy Glow trying to escape, Cozy Glow being apprehended, and then the next we see of Cozy Glow is that she is Tartarus. I guess you could insert more trying to reason with Cozy Glow in the cut between apprehension and condemnation, but if so the conclusion to take is that for Cozy Glow it apparently didn’t work and so she ended up in Tartarus.
You’re making claims about a lack of maturity and experience for Cozy Glow based on her being a filly, but that’s not what the show shows us. The show shows us that she is a master manipulator, maybe the best in the show, and her being filly (or at least appearing) does is serve as another asset for her manipulations. You seem to be further confirming that you’re just woobifying her because she is a filly, and as a result Cozy Glow is manipulating you just as she manipulated the characters in the show. Your comment about her no longer being able to manipulate people because now they know her for what she is reminds me of a case study I read about a sociopathic youth. Even after being diagnosed he still fooled people with feigned redemptions, the only person who saw through it was his personal psychologist. It would probably go down similar for Cozy Glow, and Twilight Sparkle is naive enough that she would probably fall for it. She’s a sweet and tender hooligan, and she’ll never do it again, at least not until the next time. :P
Fluttershy is Discord’s leash. I know some real sociopaths who similarly have grown found of someone and have reigned in order to protect that someone, I’ve been that someone myself. Maybe they could do something similar with Cozy Glow. It’s easier said than done though.
What are you talking about? All I’m trying to say is that Cozy should have recieved the same second chance/help as the previously reformed villains. How does China come into this? And really, your the one who commented on this first months after the last comment. If you don’t like this discussion then its kind of your fault.
I never said that Twilight told Cozy that she was wrong, I’m only saying that she didn’t give her a chance and didn’t try to reform her. Stating that she failed to teach her doesn’t change that.
And Cozy can’t be given any checks? Discord and Stalight at least had powerful magic while they were being reformed and Cozy doesn’t even have that. And in what way couldn’t they do what they did with Starlight? She only surrendered herself after Twilight managed to barely talk her out of it. What if Twilight managed to beat her normally? Is being powerful enough to force you opponent to try and reform you a requirament now?
Cozy is safer because she doesn’t have the strong magical powers of Discord and Starlight and the fact that she’s a filly makes her physically weaker as well and the lack of experience and maturity also helps somewhat. As for being a manipulater, that wouldn’t work that well when everyone is on to her act and she’s not exactly fallible going back to the Rusty Bucket case. And Starlight and Discord have also proven to be effective manipulators, with Discord even manipulating Cozy, Tirek and Crysalis for a while.
I meant both, with your naivety being that you think it has to be done this particular way. As for forcing someone into a “redemption program”, holy cow. I’m just going to say I’m glad you’re not in charge of our society as your authoritarian stance is terrifying. That’s the sort of thing they do to the Uyghurs in China. Anyway, Cozy Glow was already in a program and she still failed. We’re just repeating ourselves here so END OF DISCUSSION.
Twilight did try, and she failed. What part of “ I’m sorry I couldn’t teach you that.” don’t you understand? This was, by the way, right after she explained to Cozy Glow why what she did was wrong, yet you’re specifically denying that Twilight did that.
Regarding the trustworthiness of Discord and Starlight Glimmer, the dynamics of their redemptions is complicated. They had various checks put in place that were only removed after they “proved” themselves to be trustworthy (And of course Discord still proved to be untrustworthy, but he’s not Starlight Glimmer). Because the dynamics are complicated you can’t just substitute one for the other. I guess maybe they could have done something similar with her as they did with Discord AFTER they apprehended her, but they didn’t. They couldn’t do what they did with Starlight Glimmer though, as unlike Discord or Cozy Glow she surrendered herself to Twilight before she was put through any reformation program.
Saying that Cozy Glow is safer because she is a filly is nonsense. As far as I’m concerned her being filly is limited to her appearances only and it’s foolish to treat any differently from any of the other villains on the basis of her apparent age. The real reason she would be less dangerous is because she lacks any magical powers, but she’s still a master manipulator and that’s where the real danger lies.
You said it was a naive way of looking at it. I’m not sure if you meant that for me or Starlight, but while you cant force someone to change you can at least force them into a program to change them like with Discord. A reason why many people feel that her chance wasn’t very good. But at least she got a chance.
Having a reason is not the same as trying to rebuke that reason or trying to explain to them that its wrong. I’d say, how does only asking for why they did count as reasoning? And yes, she was apologizing for failing to teach her, but thats still not a second chance now, is it? And no, Twilight obviously shouldn’t just make Cozy her assistant again just like how Starlight shouldn’t have offered Chrysalis to be a queen or how Celestia shouldn’t have gotten Discord to try and track down Tirek. And as for untrustworthyness: Discord and Starlight also had moments of untrustworthyness in the past, but an attempt at reformation was made with both of them and it succeeded. As such, Twilight should have tried reforming her based on her and the other’s experiences with those two and Tempest. With a filly, surely it would have been safer. Instead, she was immedietly given up on and tossed into Tartarus.